cityarcade | BRAINSTORM!

Okay, I made the post so I should probably contribute something. Truthfully I'm excessively smooth-brained so I'm low on ideas for something game-wide or at least sort of sprawled out, so here's just me saying a bunch of stuff.

- Obviously it's Pride, so we'll have a Pride gathering. Gatherings are always good in theory, but in practice, I feel like we aren't always sure who we should tag? At least, I am, even though if someone asked "Do you want anyone to tag Jae? If so, who?" my answer would always be "Yes and yes," and I assume the same is true for most/all of us. So what's a good way to facilitate that? Do we kind of just make an unofficial attempt to all tag at least one character we haven't played off of to switch things up? This isn't Pride specific, I'm talking gatherings in general, but Pride is probably up next, after Lestat's that just went up.

- For Jae, it's really hard for him to make real connections. That's a personality thing, and I came into playing him knowing that, so I'm not too bothered by the notion of keeping his circle small, but it does present a challenge to the ability to give him a circle at all. Part of this is also that I am inactive!! But also I would be perhaps less inactive were there activities, which is why we are here. So two parts to this: 1) for my part, I need to make a greater effort to throw Jae into new situations, including ones where he'll be uncomfortable (he's always uncomfortable, so that's fine) and 2) I am reaching out because I want him to know more people. They don't have to be besties. They can even just be people who annoy each other, I don't care, that's funny. Maybe we need another one of those post where we share the kind of interactions we're really hoping for with our characters like we've done before? Though of course this post can also be that.

For Jae, that's really just whoever can put up with an angsty but adorable little 20-something ex-serial killer who's Bad at Peopling.

- What kinds of activities would people actually be interested in? There are always the various parties and holidays and such, but what's something that creates an opportunity for more interaction? Pet shelter adoption day at the mall? Speed dating at Slothburger? Impromptu Drembleydrop in the park?

- What do y'all see as a barrier? For me, I just have to routinely remind myself that people actually wanna play with me, so really I am, as ever, my own worst barrier. There's also the part where, if I'm inactive, I get a little nervous about becoming active again and really have to remind myself of the above. But because of that, I don't really build up sufficient recs to bring anyone else, so I only have my little antisocial dumbass who is very content only to have one friend (his fiancé).

I'm technically still working so I will circle back with more incoherent thoughts later.

For activities, I keep thinking about bringing back the farmer's market gatherings that we used to do, especially now that it's warm out, and then... not doing it. But that could be fun, maybe, since characters could be buying or selling, ones with food or craft skills or whatever could show that off?

Personally, something that's been on my mind lately is coming up with... not a one-off plot, but something substantial, to shift the status quo a little. I just don't know what that should be, and I wouldn't want to introduce something that people were really against, or whatever. So, I don't know, this is very nonspecific, but does anyone have any thoughts on that front? Any ideas, any interest, any stark disinterest? I wouldn't want to change the, like, nature of the game outright — I think there are players, and we all have characters, who prefer quiet domesticity and interpersonal stuff — but it's been a long time, and I like the thought of finding a way to shake things up, if that's something people would be at all into.

I do think we started hinting at something interesting, with having the NPCs be more hostile. It's a seed that's been sorta planted, and I'd be really interested to see people run with that.

AGREE. I was planning on having Jae sort of get closer gradually to some of the neighborhood NPCs, but it'd be neat to offset that by having others be increasingly distrustful of him as well because he's an ~outsider, which is very thematic for him. It's definitely something to gradually build on. I think we could go some interesting places with that eventually.

Yeah, agreed on this end, too — plus, I think it could be a good way to facilitate connections between played characters who might be more reticent in forming relationships. (Which also gets back to your earlier point, Stef.)

I am wholly uncaffeinated but I'll just throw this out there because we did it in my last game and it ripped, and we also did it here once and it ripped, so consider: DREAM PARTIES.

What is a dream party? It is a shared dreamspace that can drag in anyone in the game (and potentially others but we'll get to that), with themes and moods and vibes that vary from dream to dream.

Why does it happen? Well, the first time it happened it was because John got hungie, but ultimately the questionable-entity-that-is-Darrow can do whatever it wants, psychic plagiarism included.

How often does it happen? We used to do it monthly and had it pull double-duty as a test drive (that's where the 'and potentially others' comes in), which ruled because it meant you could technically meet characters before they arrived and be like 'wait a minute, I know you, we fought clowns together in that haunted carnival nightmare, what's up.'

What does a dream party entail? Literally whatever you want. Maybe you want to do a daemon AU or drop everyone into the hunger games or do some weird high-concept dream logic stuff or alter everyone's moods. Maybe you want to mess around with a very high-stakes dangerous situation without having to worry about your character actually dying (or being fined for property damage). Maybe you want to meet more people but your character is a homebody and it would be easier if they just conveniently happened to find themselves lost on the same space station orbiting Saturn as everyone else. Maybe you want to have a fraught, emotional interaction with someone that only one of you remembers upon waking for maximum angst (because hey, you don't always remember your dreams). The possibilities are endless!

Anyway DREAM PARTIES that's my pitch.

Oh shit yes

I loved when this first came up, and I think we set it in place as something that COULD be recurring, but it hasn't actually become that. I am SO down for making it more of a thing, and I love the idea of it doubling as a more fleshed-out test drive type thing, too. I wouldn't have thought of that, and it'd make a great way for people to test characters out in a more substantial way before fully committing, or just to scratch the itch and move on. I'M ABOUT THIS

Yeah like... theoretically John could do it again, but a) at this point he doesn't really need to because we've come up with an ig solution to Statement withdrawal just to kind of put that recurring issue to bed, and b) since he's specifically into people's nightmares, I feel like they'd all just be kind of miserable and same-y. Whereas if Darrow is behind it, we could branch out a lot more in terms of themes/vibes/etc.

And yes, they worked great as TDs! It was also, as you said, a convenient way to play a one-off pup who was a great fit for the dream scenario but maybe not a realistic prospect for the game at large.

Plus, the opt-in/opt-out was built right in and extremely easy to employ (maybe you don't dream that night, nbd), so there's less implicit pressure to come up with an idea that pleases everyone, and less stress on the part of players who don't want to engage with an idea but can't figure out a realistic way to avoid it.

Edited 2024-06-08 03:05 (UTC)

I love this idea so much. It's low-stakes, opt-in, with the potential for literally ANY drama the involved players want, without necessarily lasting consequences. And we saw from John's nightmare gathering that people are FUCKING CLEVER with playing in a dreamscape.

And the double duty as TD is fun as hell too, because it would help people establish CR with one or more individuals before entry! Some pups don't do well with being unseated into unfamiliar territory. Even one familiar face can make the difference! And if it was a bad dream, well, that just adds to the drama lmao

Exactly - you get the emotional payoff of playing out whatever the situation is without the broader disruption to the actual status quo of the city itself.

I also really do think it would be fun to have TDs that are a bit more substantive, and that overlap enough with actual gameplay that there's incentive to participate even if you don't have an app on the horizon or any new characters you want to huck around - that benefits both the current character base and anyone who wants to voice test.

Edited 2024-06-08 14:54 (UTC)

First, I want to say how much I love you people and this game and everything we've built together. I recognize we're all in very different places than we were when the game started, and we've grown older and busier.

My suggestions are both on a structural/administrative level, and then I have plot suggestions.

1. The current req system doesn't work in the best interest of us or the game itself. We all acknowledge we are tagging more slowly, especially when life is busy or tough, which it unfortunately is sometimes. I've personally found it's taking longer to complete reqs, and to do it two months in a row has been a task that has become unwieldy. It's pretty discouraging, and it's a lot of work that I don't think we, as adults who have known each other this long, need in the same way, at the same level. It also really cuts down on new fictional blood in the game, and I feel really strongly that new characters are needed to pump life back into things. I'd like to think that as a consequence of being an older group that knows each other well, if someone needs to really look at how they're handling, say, a large roster that doesn't have activity, this could be an honest and kind discussion about how that impacts other people and a plan could be made to go forward.

2. PLOTS. My favorite plots are mostly horror, surprising no one at all. So I do have a handful of those tucked away-- maybe more extra islands or locations where we can do something like Fromville from the TV show From. I also like the dream set-up suggested above for this. Perhaps there's a Lovecraftian entity awakening in Darrow to cause bubbled horror (to spare those who don't like it).

3. Lore, city-based plots. One of the initial causes of drama and tension in the game was being at the hands of this unknown force that made it seem like you were expected there, and the city had no answers. Overall, I think we've lost this effect just because it's been years, and the in-game culture grown by our characters is that everything's expected and no one should even try for answers. I'd like to see this shake up too, maybe with some new NPCs or NPC organizations that hint there is something at the root of things, there are people pulling the strings. There doesn't need to be an ultimate answer or antagonist, but something to shake up what the established characters know about Darrow.

Okay, I love you lots!

Just want to note here that the first is something we mods are all aware of and feeling too, and conversations are happening about how best to address this. I appreciate your thoughtful commentary on it here — keep an eye out in the coming days. ♥

I love your last idea here. You're right, that was a big Thing early on that's sort of fallen by the wayside as just being ~how things are, but that would be a fun thing to lean back into, the mystery and sense of something greater at play.

And you KNOW I'm always down for a horror plot. 8D

Oooooh, and I think that last point really COULD play into the seed we've already planted-- that NPCs are becoming more hostile. And that could give us a clearer direction in mind, even if there never ends up being an "answer."

I'm also thinking even things that are getting a glimpse at something like a glitch in the matrix sort of deal-- maybe there's a gathering post where characters witness some person in a uniform late to the train station to deliver a new arrival packet. Or 'malfunctioning' NPCs. Some incident where some part of the city is wrong and has a clean-up crew attending. A mini-plot where a weird time flux literally opens up old wounds (this one is more far out but we would all do this to them). Stuff to suggest there just might be rhyme or reason to characters being pulled here, and that Darrow itself might be having issues.

To your third point, I love the idea of lore-filled, city-based plots! But I do want to say that most of my pups actually prefer Darrow to their home canons, so they just don't WANT to investigate and risk the city ejecting them for their hubris XD but for me as a PLAYER, I've gotten the sense that there isn't much of a point for any of my pups who would be inclined TO investigate the city, because they won't be able to solve it anyway? And I absolutely understand that that's one of the points of Darrow, is there is no answer, so I'd be curious to see how something like this would be approached and handled.

I like the above ideas of things in Darrow being shaken up, though I'd like to emphasize that Darrow being a slice of life game is one of its biggest draw for me. I miss the more regular plots we'd have (the silly ones like Truth on Your Back, as much as the scarier ones, like the Darkness, the faeries, etc), and I super miss regular apartment gatherings and stuff bc they were a little more insular than the broader gatherings in the park or at the boardwalk, allowing for more specific groups of people to meet and interact. I know not as many pups stay at their assigned apartments anymore (for example, Daniel and Tom now live in a new complex called Orchard Heights), but maybe we could do... Idk, neighborhood/street gatherings somehow?

I've been wondering how to broach the topic so I guess now is as good a time as any. I wonder if Darrow is just too... small, now? I agree with Jessie that new pup blood will help, but for the pups that have stuck around for so long, I feel like there is a bit of a 'now what?' rut that I know I'VE fallen into more than once, so idk if it'd help or hinder to have the game's borders grow or change? We have East Hallow, I'd love to see it get more use, or even for another, sudden space in/adjacent to Darrow to appear similarly. I don't know if it's as simple as "people move there" or if there could or should be another plot (revenge of the harvesters, idk), but it feels like wasted real estate right now.

I've also toyed with the idea of a recurring (quarterly? Monthly? Bi-annual?) Gold Saucer plot, bringing in more of Alisaie and Alphinaud's canon. Basically, the Manderville Gold Saucer is an adult arcade and casino, with many games and micro events that players in FFXIV can play for Gold Saucer Points (MGP) that they can then spend on things only available within the Saucer for the duration of the plot. They could be something rare and exciting, something for them specifically, or something as simple as a sabotender or chocobo stuffie, idk XD I'm light on the details. But I thought it'd be a fun gathering idea, and since in FFXIV the proprietor of the Saucer already breaks laws of physics and nature whenever necessary, it felt like a good fit for Darrow.

I also have another plot idea in the works that I've been hesitant to email to the mod account simply BECAUSE of the dwindling activity. It would be best timed to Halloween but could feasibly be done whenever. Maybe I'll work on that and send it in soon.

Edited (edits for clarification purposes) 2024-06-08 10:53 (UTC)

I agree with this! I think shaking up the city proper may help a bit. When we came up with East Hallow, I was hoping it would inspire others to use it for plots. It's a whole other town, just sitting there!

I also have a half-fleshed out idea involving an airport and maybe giving characters the opportunity to visit other destinations on a limited basis. What those destinations are is the part not fleshed out yet.

I have to admit, I completely forget East Hallow is even there most of the time, which is entirely on me. Does it currently have any residents or is it still abandoned?

Yeah, as I said in my comment above, I know there are players and characters (including some of mine) who prefer and are better suited to slice of life stuff, more quietness and interpersonal relationships than big big plot stuff, and any shifts designed to shake things up would definitely still account and allow for this. The whole concept of the game isn't going to change for sure.

As for apartment/neighborhood gatherings or whatever, no one is stopping anyone from posting those if they want to! I think people tend to think with gatherings that they should be more broadly accessible, rather than limiting who it's open to (and there aren't many played characters currently living in the starter apartment buildings; when those posts were happening before, pretty much everyone had, if not a character in whatever building, then a close connection they could be going to see or whatever in order to tag in), but that info is on the wiki for people to reference if they want to facilitate connections that way, or if they want to do their own post in a certain area, or something privately threaded but open to whoever. We want people to do what will be fun for them!

I agree with a lot of what's being said, but like Jessie said, I think along with just more frequent things for characters to DO, I feel like the game itself needs a shake up on a structural level. Darrow isn't TR and even if the game drew a lot of inspiration from that one, it's evolved, as have our players. It doesn't make sense for a lot of those rules to still apply to this game. For the most part, this game is full of players who are older, many of whom have RPed together for over a decade. We're an old style of RP. We're not attracting new players, nor are we trying to. I wonder if it's time to seriously rethink both our req system and our app system.

At this stage, we know who our players are and that they can write. We all have a sense of how many characters we can take on. The long and complicated app that we currently have feels like a bit of a relic of an older time. I realize, I'm saying this as a player with many extended periods of inactivity, but I also know that we have actually lost players from the game because of our app and req process.

I'd like to make the radical suggestion that we revamp our apps to something much simpler for current players and keep the current app for new players if we ever happen to get any.

I don't have a current suggestion for how to revamp reqs, but like Jessie said, for a game that is so much slower, making reqs is an unwieldy process. I don't think it's at all representative of whether someone is regularly playing, since so many people often cram all of their reqs into the last week or so of the month.

I also think another way we can help facilitate new interactions is to actually keep character pages on the wiki up to date. I know it's bit of a chore at times, but just basic information like how a character speaks and moves, and basic physical characteristics can go a long way to making tagging a new character easier.

I agree with the idea that new players have a different app altogether from current players; like you said, current players have been here long enough we all know how each other writes etc., but new players, if we ever end up getting any are the variable we aren't familiar with and would need the more in depth stuff.

I also LOVE that bit about the wiki pages, it can definitely be helpful to have even just basic stuff about dress style and mannerisms/attitude.

If I may also add wrt admin stuff, I wouldn't mind seeing the map get some updates, so we all know what places are where?

First, I really appreciate that this post is here. I think we've all been having little conversations about what Darrow is now, how it's changed, how we've changed, and whether it works for us. So I appreciate that we're all in the same "room" to talk about it.

I also agree with what others have said about game pace, size, and reqs not matching up to each other. I know I have one of the smallest rosters here and I would still struggle to "make reqs" most months. I think revamping that could be good for everyone's potential activity level.

On a simple level of something we could do, does anyone remember Tag Someone New at TR? It was TSN Week there, but that's not realistic. Maybe TSN Month? If you don't or you can't, no pressure, but if it's a monthly theme and there were a couple gatherings to facilitate that, it might work.

TR was before my time, but Tag Someone New sounds fun! If I'm understanding the concept from the name, it sounds like it'd be a good way to encourage pups who don't or wouldn't normally interact to meet and engage? That's why I liked the old apartment building gatherings; people who lived there could meet and chat and neighbors could be neighborly.

Yes! It was a "let's try specifically to get out of the usual patterns of threads" effort. Technically any time could be TSN time, but if it's a Thing (tm) sometimes it's easier to do? At least it was for me, because I'd be consciously considering who I could tag to be part of it.

BRAINSTORM!

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